The difference between Black Lives Matter and the Anti Mandate protest

Written By: - Date published: 9:36 am, February 15th, 2022 - 57 comments
Categories: covid-19, human rights, racism - Tags:

There have been some recent comments claiming that the current Anti Mandate protest in Wellington is not dissimilar to the Black Lives Matter protest movement that swept the world a couple of years ago.

Ben Thomas tweeted that the BLM protest in Auckland two years ago was an imported movement.  Then on Radio New Zealand Kathryn Ryan in a heated discussion with Neale Jones suggested the same.

This got me thinking are these events comparable?

I went on the Auckland BLM march two years ago.  I remember it clearly.  It was just before the country left lockdown and there was a nervousness in the crowd about getting too close to each other, even though we were outside.

The march had a strong feeling of solidarity and respect.  The organisation was somewhat hamfisted but that did not matter.  It struck a chord and people responded.

The only sign of organisational nous came from Unite Union.  As they always do they had printed a few billboards and had a banner and organised their supporters to be there.

We all walked from Aotea Square down to outside the US Embassy.  Speeches were given then we all went home.

Advertising was through social media and there was no sign of any funding.  As can be seen from the photo above many of the billboards were printed on paper and attached to cardboard.

The current Wellington protest is the antithesis of the BLM march.

For a start there is actual Nazi involvement.  Kevyn Alp, someone who has expressed a desire for the guillotining of politicians, plays a prominent part.

Then there is the resourcing.  Food trucks spontaneously appearing and handing out free food seems more than a little suspicious.

And the billboard campaign waged by Voices for Freedom is not cheap, nor is distributing 2 million pieces of information.

VFF claims:

Voices For Freedom is the trading name of the not for profit organisation legally incorporated and registered in New Zealand having three directors and shareholders Claire Deeks, Alia Bland and Libby Jonson.

VFF is funded through individual donations from thousands of concerned Kiwis. Funding is put towards the various projects we facilitate and the general running costs and overheads of the organisation.

It appears to be a registered company.  It says “we intend to provide basic information on finances such as to provide accountability and transparency at appropriate junctures and at least annually.”  Maybe it has but I cannot find any such report.

One possible explanation for funding comes from this Vice article which reported on the hacking of the Christian funding website GoSendGo and the identity of funders of the Canadian Trucker’s protest.  $8.7 million had been raised for the Canadian truckies with over half of the donors being US based with other donations coming from the United Kingdom, Australia and Ireland.  I would not be surprised if some of this funding made its way overseas.  It would be helpful for VFF and the protestors to confirm the source of their funding.

And one protest was to oppose cruelty and ill treatment of people because their skin is dark.  The other’s goals are disparate but include the complete removal of pretty well every public health measure as the Omicron wave hits.  At a time when Ministers need to focus on dealing with the Omicron wave sucking up their valuable time with a discussion that will go nowhere is pretty strange.

I still struggle with the contrast in treatment.  In the US this happened to BLM protestors:

Here in Aotearoa New Zealand police pick up and return the signs to the protestors and find them parking spaces.

Are they the same?  They are both protest movements started overseas that have had local offshoots.  But there any similarity ends.

57 comments on “The difference between Black Lives Matter and the Anti Mandate protest ”

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  1. Ad 1
    15 February 2022 at 9:49 am

    I certainly agree we don't have to like or agree with the Wellington Undead.

    But this is beginning to look like protest envy.

  2. Anker 2
    15 February 2022 at 10:35 am
    • I agree Ad.
  3. Cricklewood 3
    15 February 2022 at 10:49 am

    They're very organized in terms of resourcing the protestors on the ground. Kitchen, laundry and medical.

    I guess as the PM happily agreed that mandates would create two classes of people… there should be no suprise that the 'deplorables' dont follow the 'rules'

  4. Jenny how to get there 4
    15 February 2022 at 10:52 am

    The Left never have any money. The Right always have lots.

    Ignoring this main difference between Left and right protests.

    More comparable Left wing protests are the protests at Bastion Pt. Raglan golf course, Rugby Park Hamilton and Ihumatao. What all these protests have in common with the right wing protest on the forecourt of parliament is they all involved civil disobedience trespass and occupations.

    • Cricklewood 4.1
      15 February 2022 at 11:34 am

      From what I can see on the Facebook Page heaps of money is flowing in as small donations $20 and $50 amounts sometimes more. I'd also say labeling it right wing is lazy, it's a very broad group at Parliament or do you think the Maori and Polynesian participants have been tricked into attending by NeoNazi's?

      • Jenny how to get there 4.1.1
        15 February 2022 at 12:01 pm

        Short answer.

        Yes

        That and the failure of the centrists to offer them anything.

        Jenny how to get there
        9 February 2022 at 9:02 am
        A failure of the Left, leads to a resurgence of the Right

        https://thestandard.org.nz/open-mike-09-02-2022/#comment-1859972

      • swordfish 4.1.2
        15 February 2022 at 2:15 pm

        .

        MS

        For a start there is actual Nazi involvement. Kevyn Alp, someone who has expressed a desire for the guillotining of politicians, plays a prominent part.

        Cricklewood

        or do you think the Maori and Polynesian participants have been tricked into attending by NeoNazi's?

        Kevyn Alp would (rather inconveniently) appear to be Māori (or considers himself so). Associated with a para-military Māori separatist organisation a couple of decades back … stood in the 2011 Te Tai Tokerau by-election …

        It would appear life’s a little more complex than the crude, distorted Good vs Evil Identity group fantasy world inhabited by CRT & BLM zealots.

        All of which puts me in mind of the dubious intentions behind the Urewera paramilitary training camps 2005-07 … one of the fantasist nutters involved now regularly invoked here as an important commentator.

        • weka 4.1.2.1
          15 February 2022 at 2:24 pm

          Cricklewood's question is still valid though. It's a disparate group, and there's a cognitive dissonance in neo-nazis, peace and love hippies and Maori/Pasifica protesting together. Many left/liberals/progressives/whatevers are struggling to make sense of this and thus end up emphasising one or the other.

          • Cricklewood 4.1.2.1.1
            15 February 2022 at 3:02 pm

            To me, it feels like plenty of lefties are compartmentalizing it as a Right Wing fascist protest as a means to justify their opposition.

            Reality is the mandates and anti vax stances cut across all demographics of society, personally I find it remarkable and heartening that such a disparate group have managed to band together and form what is now a very well resourced and organized protest group.

            When the decision was made to create two separate classes of New Zealander, a decision which drastically altered the financial circumstances and lives of a substantial number of people, I feel the Govt failed to make any sort of contingency plan on what would happen to those people who whilst small in percentage are large in number and some are now desperate.

            Where we are now was inevitable, where things go from here is not, but both sides are digging in and with the political rhetoric involved, things are only going to get worse and that's really going to hurt society long after Covid.

            Politicians need to start talking and coming to broad consensus about what ending mandates looks like, (I would favor something along the lines of the pandemic response committee).
            We should also land some Novavax asap as I suspect that may give some people a graceful way out of a pretty entrenched anti vax stance.

            Both of these would I hope diffuse the situation a little without anyone losing face.

    • Sean 4.2
      16 February 2022 at 8:47 pm

      BLM got hundreds of millions of dollars. They're trying to explain where 60 million went at the moment.

  5. Corey Humm 5
    15 February 2022 at 12:29 pm

    Both protests broke the law and disregarded COVID settings for an imported American style protest.

    I've seen so many people who participated in BLM protests against police brutality wanting police to brutalize the Wellington protesters, many, many many of them Maori which is flabbergasting.

    I've also seen many people who donated to the BLM movement which in USA many turned into months long riots and vandalized monuments to ww2 soldiers (but those were OUTLIERS and BLM shouldn't be tarred because of actions of a few) praise GoFundMe me for taking away the millions raised for Ottawa protests because local police told GoFundMe to do so.

    I've heard so many say that big tech doesn't have to provide people with a platform, but think about this as a left winger for a second big tech is not our friend, if big tech decides to listen to local authorities and not give donated money because local laws said a protest was wrong then future movements like Blm, Arabs springs, hing king , occupy, climate movements, sit ins, anyone on the left who goes against the narrative of the powerful will be shut down, censored, deplatformed.

    By supporting the suppression of protest and free speech by govt and big tech all the left are doing is making it easier to step on people who are fighting for things we agree with in the future.

    We don't have to agree with these protests. I don't. I do however think we're throwing the baby out with the bath water if we use force on them.

    A good start was made by offering them free parking unclogging the streets but also showing them the states not unreasonable, I think maybe if the pm says passports will end in six months their numbers will dwindle and it'd also give certainty to the rest of us.

    I hope it ends peacefully what ever happens

  6. remo 6
    15 February 2022 at 12:36 pm

    "when the omigodacon wave hits…." should be right on flu season numbers spike that 'doctor Dashley does it again' can fear-ramp to the max, throwing another billion or two on an experimental (redefined as) VAX – a DARPA toxin that stops nothing. Infact appears by other accounts to exacerbate whatever is in the original GoF sequence formed in the FAUCI/WUHAN joint venture biolabs. Sold on the line that 'it'll be worse for you if you don't '. Whereas International VAERS data has it 'you'll be much worse off if you do."

    This is nothing like BLM. This is more like 'Save the Children.'

    • Shanreagh 6.1
      15 February 2022 at 12:48 pm

      What does this mean? Where is the quote from please. Can you link. At the moment it is just a whole lot of gobbledygook.

      How is it Save the Children' when children are being taken to a protest with horrible conditions underfoot?

      There is the ability for parents to vaccinate their children is well explained here

      https://covid19.govt.nz/covid-19-vaccines/get-the-facts-about-covid-19-vaccination/covid-19-vaccination-and-children/

    • weka 6.2
      15 February 2022 at 4:23 pm

      I also can't make sense of your comment. Next time, please take the time to construct sentences in ways that most people can understand. Use more punctuation for a start, but if you are putting things in " " they need to be actual quotes and have a link. Otherwise use ' '.

      • remo 6.2.1
        16 February 2022 at 9:44 am

        Weka. Thank you. It may be, however, 'the inertia of prior belief', rather than punctuation, is the issue.

        https://rumble.com/vs5r0m-mass-formation-psychosis.html

        • weka 6.2.1.1
          16 February 2022 at 10:38 am

          well that's an interesting inference, but I still have no idea what you mean. Best to say things plainly.

          • remo 6.2.1.1.1
            17 February 2022 at 5:14 pm

            Plainly.
            COVID is a bioweapon. Constructed by 'Gain of Function' processes in the bioweapons labs of USAMO/DEEPSTATE; as documented in the FAUCI/WUHAN joint venture via EcoHealthAlliance (Peter Daszak). COVID-19 is a bioweapons attack, with differing views on initial targeting (China and Iran) but now understood to be an attack on the human rights of free peoples everywhere. The experimental mRna drugs, redefined as 'vaccine', in response to the COVID drop [-making bigPHARMA trillions -] must also be considered a bioweapon, given the damage VAERS data now records. Luc Montagnier (HIV-Nobel Laureate) found, among other indicators, HIV inserted into the 'virus' sequence – hence introduction of HIV now into media narratives https://youtu.be/durcHyxpFT4 Judy Mikovits long ago warned that the 'virus' was a lab creation under FAUCIs control, and the vaccines were dangerous. (Lance D Johnson/ NaturalNews.com "Dr. Mikovits confirmed that isolated, certified reference material for SARS-CoV-2 does not exist. The virus has never been isolated from human cells and was never a human virus in the first place. The SARS-CoV-2 virus can only be manufactured and replicated in the vero monkey kidney cell line, which is a group of epithelial cells extracted from African green monkeys in the 1960s. These monkey cell lines, readily contaminated with latent retroviruses, have been injected into the population since the mid-90s through the flu, MMR and polio vaccine supply, and are the only originating vector by which SARS-CoV-2 can manifest disease in humans.") Peter Duesberg ('Inventing the AIDSVirus' ISBN-089526-470-b) warned of FAUCIs role in manipulation of data creating HIV-AIDS/AZT atrocity as template for the COVID psyop. This new mRna technology 'gene therapy', redefined as 'vaccine', requires large scale human trialing to refine its purpose, which appears, among others, designed to suppress human immune systems(ADE). Hence the need for illegal, immoral and anti-ethical 'mandates' required to generate uptake (for which our Government must be held to account) These illegal, immoral and anti-ethical mandates are only possible under the fear propaganda driven by EUA – Emergency Use Authorisation; itself generated by WHO Pandemic pronouncements. The term Pandemic itself has been redefined by WHO – controlled by arch eugenicist Bill GATES – by excluding reference to the words "with enormous numbers of deaths and illness." – to allow implementation of EUA ; hence mandates for experimental drug use. As said; both 'virus' and 'vaccine' were created in the FAUCI/WUHAN/ joint venture DEEPSTATE bioweapons Labs, and released during a pandemic exercise called 'Crimson Contagion' as reported by the self confessing liar and thief Mike POMPEO, when he stated at a press conference "we're in a live exercise here". TRUMP, standing behind him can clearly be heard saying "…should have let us know". https://youtu.be/McOhzb3Th9A I'd argue the Ardern Government is 'gaining' as many powers as it can, while it can in 'LOCKSTEP' [ https://thuletide.wordpress.com/2021/08/06/operation-lockstep/ ]as part of Klaus Schwab's Global 'Great Reset' (WEF World Economic Forum) agenda, running on the back of this bio-attack.

            We are the lab monkeys in a global experiment. Good luck. We are all going to need it.

  7. Chris T 7
    15 February 2022 at 1:48 pm

    TBH Given the current Wellington one has become such a splintered beast of different groups protesting different issues, it wouldn't surprise me if there BLM people amongst it.

    Protests are legal, suck it up.

  8. millsy 8
    15 February 2022 at 2:24 pm

    The anti-vax protest, to a man, woman or fluid, all thought that George Floyd derserved to die in the streets, like a dog, at the hands of a racist Trump supporting cop.

    These anti vaxers, are racist, homophobic, trasphobic, Christian Dominionists who want to impose the Bible on society at the point of a gun.

    There is a huge difference.

    And if you look at the anti-vax commentators in the USA, Bari Weiss, Tim Pool,, Glen Greenwald, etc, none of them have a problem with George Floyd’s death or police brutality.

    [apologies to the community for a ban with no warning, but given how many times I’ve moderated millsy for this in the past, I’m not going to waste my time here again. Four week ban, twice the last one, for yet again making up so much shit as to be flaming and trolling in one foul swoop. You’ve also been warned in the past about making claims about public figures without back up – weka]

    • Chris T 8.2
      15 February 2022 at 2:47 pm

      Lol

      Like the hysteria, but the majority are anti-mandate and probably vaccinated

      lol

    • higherstandard 8.3
      15 February 2022 at 2:58 pm

      Clean up on aisle 3..

      • Puckish Rogue 8.3.1
        15 February 2022 at 3:12 pm

        Its all right, Millsy is just getting it out of his system.

        It must have been torture for him, being banned while this protest was happening.

        But I'm sure he'll calm down

    • Cricklewood 8.4
      15 February 2022 at 3:08 pm

      No doubt Millsy would be happy to see jackboots stomping the current protestors into the mud.

    • Rosemary McDonald 8.5
      15 February 2022 at 3:30 pm

      Excuse me.

      The anti-vax protest, to a man, woman or fluid, all thought that George Floyd derserved to die in the streets, like a dog, at the hands of a racist Trump supporting cop.

      These anti vaxers, are racist, homophobic, trasphobic, Christian Dominionists who want to impose the Bible on society at the point of a gun.

      Are you referring to the Kiwis currently exercising their right of protest in Wellington and Picton? Those demanding the end to Covid vaccine mandates?

      If so…you need to produce some cold hard evidence to support your assertions or withdraw and apologize.

      I am surprised the moderators didn't jump all over this.

      Or did I miss the /sarc ?

      • weka 8.5.1
        15 February 2022 at 3:47 pm

        I am surprised the moderators didn't jump all over this.

        Just let me know directly. We're not reading every single comment in real time. A reply to me in somewhere like OM, with a link, will get my attention.

    • Andy 8.6
      15 February 2022 at 4:29 pm

      Note to Weka,

      Thanks these comments from Millsy are very unhelpful.

  9. swordfish 9
    15 February 2022 at 2:43 pm

    .
    Nothing justifies the threats of violence from Alp & others … but lest we descend into the systematic double standard territory so reguarly embraced by the ID Politics wing of “the Left” (can barely bring myself to call you the Left … in key respects, you’re the antithesis) ……..

    (dare I employ the 'W' word, here ? surprise) …

    .

    TPPA protest:

    • Puckish Rogue 9.1
      15 February 2022 at 3:08 pm

      No no thats completely different, not even comparable

      • Cricklewood 9.1.1
        15 February 2022 at 3:12 pm

        wink

      • weka 9.1.2
        15 February 2022 at 3:48 pm

        Did they issue death threats to the Nat MPs? Did they say they wanted to arrest them, put them on trial, with an end point of execution?

        • Puckish Rogue 9.1.2.1
          15 February 2022 at 3:57 pm

          I agree, theres nothing to see here.

          All they're doing is using a mock up of a guillotine to pretend to cut the heads of politicians and theres absolutely nothing wrong with that.

          • weka 9.1.2.1.1
            15 February 2022 at 4:10 pm

            it does seem like more innocent times. But the differences here are more important. Once people start making death threats instead of doing street theatre, we should be paying more attention. Did you see that Arp got arrested? That's serious shit.

            • Puckish Rogue 9.1.2.1.1.1
              15 February 2022 at 4:26 pm

              I can't prove it but if you're setting up a pretend guillotine do you really think no one in the crowd called for Keys head

              I dealt with Arps in J Block a couple of years ago, very quiet as I recall

              • Tricledrown …
                16 February 2022 at 11:37 am

                Isn't that breaking that person's right to privacy PR.

                • Puckish Rogue …
                  16 February 2022 at 11:40 am

                  No.

                  Its public record he was in prison and I haven't mentioned anything of his crimes or anything of his behaviour that would be considered prejudicial

                  Nice try though

    • DukeEll 9.2
      15 February 2022 at 7:23 pm

      So alt right of you to make that comparison

  10. Drowsy M. Kram 10
    15 February 2022 at 6:49 pm

    Imho both 'movements' are protesting that something is impeding their normal life.

    Difference between BLM and Anti-Mandate protests is the nature of the 'impediment'; 'skin colour' for BLM, versus 'COVID-19 vaccination status' in the case of anti-mandate.

    Is 'white privilege' really a divisive term? [28 June 2021]
    This shows a failure in the proper communication of the meaning of the term “white privilege”. As many have pointed out, it does not mean white people are not disadvantaged, their lives are not hard, or they have not suffered, it just means their skin colour is not an impediment in their lives.

    A further difference being that one of these impediments is easily remedied.
    We're about to find out just how 'pandemic-lucky' most NZers have been sad

    https://irp.nih.gov/podcast/2021/08/drs-natasha-caplen-and-richard-maraia-whats-next-in-the-rnage

  11. Julian Richards 11
    15 February 2022 at 7:16 pm

    "it feels like an imported protest to me"

    – Jacinda Ardern. Covid mandate protests

    https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/127764002/protest-at-parliament-looks-imported-jacinda-ardern-says-questions-the-motivations-of-those-involved

    "I've always said the hardest thing in this country about race or racism or just all of that, is really even talking about it."

    -Jacinda Ardern. BLM protests.

    https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/418061/ardern-says-george-floyd-situation-in-us-horrifying

    The difference is in the political sense.

    • quote correction 11.1
      16 February 2022 at 3:02 pm

      Guled Mire said "I've always said the hardest thing in this country about race or racism or just all of that, is really even talking about it." in the RNZ article you linked, not Ardern

      • Julian Richards 11.1.1
        16 February 2022 at 4:43 pm

        Apologies, yes that was wrong. It was Guled Mire who said that in the rnz article. And he was correct in revealing this by saying it.

        What Jacinda Arden did say was "… that's important to us as a nation that we don't shy away from those debates and those discussions.".

  12. Nic the NZer 12
    15 February 2022 at 9:21 pm

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c1jzbfLzAiI

    Discussion with a reporter investigating "Did Black Lives Matter Leaders Cash In on a Movement?".

    Its clearly a bit different to the Canada Mandate people disappearing with funds pledged online, but the outcome may have been similar.

  13. Ross 13
    15 February 2022 at 9:27 pm

    The other’s goals are disparate but include the complete removal of pretty well every public health measure as the Omicron wave hits.

    The complete removal of pretty well every public health measure? I’ve told you a million times, Micky, not to exaggerate.

    The protestors, like those protesting for the right of gay marriage before them, are on the right side of history. Vaccine mandates cannot be justified and should be rescinded immediately. When most new cases of Covid are those who are fully vaccinated, the obvious question is what is the point of mandates? What are they trying to achieve?

    In 2020, the PM said there would be no sanctions or penalties for the unvaccinated. Her idea of sanctions and penalties must be considerably different to mine.

  14. tsmithfield 14
    16 February 2022 at 6:32 am

    I have just finished watching an excellent docu-drama series "The Last Tzars".

    Obviously a completely different level, but there are some parallels our leaders should take note of, I think.

    The reason for the revolution essentially was that the Tzar completely ignored the needs of the population, and treated them like dirt, to the extent that the mass population really had no other choice than to revolt if they wanted change.

    The situation in Wellington is very different in terms of degree, the cause, and that it is only a small minority of the population.

    But the lessons are the same: When people feel they have nothing left to lose, then some will engage in extreme action if the actions they are already taking aren’t having an effect. This possibility should be a great concern to our politicians. It would be terrible to see a political assassination in New Zealand. But I think there are enough crazies in the protest group and with those that sympathise for that to be a real possibility.

    I think that, rather than refuse to engage, a multi-party representative group should start engaging with the protesters. Perhaps just acknowledging their suffering and giving them some idea of what threshold needs to be reached for mandates to be dropped might be enough to end the protest.

    • Tricledrown 14.1
      16 February 2022 at 11:46 am

      Tsm comparing a feudal dictatorship with what's considered one of the worls most open democracies is a futile attempt a false equivalence.

  15. aj 15
    16 February 2022 at 10:41 am

    Neil Jones puts up as good defense of the Government's approach but is talked over by the other two. I'd love to see someone study the number of time Ryan interrupts and talks over Neale vs Bridget in these 9-noon segments.

    Bridget splits hairs all the time.

    Bridget Morton

    "She needs to talk to them, these are the citizens she represents as much as anyone else…"

    Neil

    "I am going to push back on the idea that politicians needs to go and negotiate with people who are demanding their execution…"

    Neil has interpreted what Bridget's suggested as most people would.

    Kathryn

    "That's not what Bridget said and it's not what I'm suggesting…no one is suggesting it would be a great idea wandering out necessarily in this febrile environment at the moment…"

    Kathryn runs a cover move for Bridget, as she is fond of doing. It is what Bridget said, but she prattles on as she so often does (very annoyingly) and the discussion to wander on.

    Adern has 'spoken' to the protesters.

    Asked what her message to protesters was, Ardern said: "Go home – and take your children."

    • Visubversa 15.1
      16 February 2022 at 3:10 pm

      Not just execution but one asshole who hides behind the name Felix on Counterspin Media (Steve Bannon's site) actually posted this. I have nothing but revulsion for the lot of them.

      May be an image of text that says 'COUNTERSPIN MEDIA HOLD THE LINE Police are moving in ag... LTGT 1V1 Felix When we win I want to eat nieve!!!! 2:42 PM'

      • aj 15.1.1
        16 February 2022 at 7:42 pm

        one asshole ….. actually posted this. I have nothing but revulsion for the lot of them.

        That is truly frightening – that somebody could post that. Everything that is disgusting about social media in one post.

      • felix 15.1.2
        20 February 2022 at 12:23 pm

        It wasn't me. I don't eat people.

  16. Obtrectator 16
    16 February 2022 at 7:01 pm

    I don't know how relevant this is to the original topic, but it sounds ominous:

    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2022/feb/15/swansea-black-lives-matter-british-blm-group-closes-down-after-police-infiltration-attempt

    An organisation promoting legitimate (and largely peaceful) protest is perceived as a threat and monstered out of existence. I suppose the take-away from that is not to have a conventional organisational structure that can be a focus for violence or subject to subversion.

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  • Speech to the Southland Otago Regional Engineering Collective Summit, 18 April 2024
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  • Supporting better financial outcomes for Kiwis
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  • Removing red tape to help early learners thrive
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